Basic HL/Taigen Recoil mod Query

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Jarlath
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Basic HL/Taigen Recoil mod Query

Post by Jarlath » Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:28 pm

OK, so I see all the mods that you can add for the HL/Taigen MFU's to make these tanks have Tamiya IR/Servo Barrel Recoil/No Track Recoil, etc...
(aka Mako Boards) and I have used them as well in the past for tanks which I wanted to make IR Battlers...

I have looked at the Sirvoe, but again seems to be so much more than I am looking for.
Is there a cheap/simple version of the Sirvoe/Mako that only incorporates the barrel recoil option?

Literally want to put in a servo recoil unit (Clark/JCC/homemade/etc...) into a HL tank.

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phyrephish
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Re: Basic HL/Taigen Recoil mod Query

Post by phyrephish » Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:28 pm

Apparently if you mod a standard servo to continuous rotation and remove the servo control pcb you can get a resemblance of recoil by simply plugging the servo motor into the BB motor output. You must also design you own recoil system for the cyclic motion of the servo AND then reattach the micro switch so that it is closed at the bottom of the recoil action. This would be the absolute cheapest way to get recoil like action.

BUT it requires both knowledge and skills AND picking the right servo for the job. You want a servo that will complete at least one full revolution during the period that the bb motor is on. Now if you are lucky your in your first servo choice then great if not you will need to BUY another servo because once the servo is chopped up it is no good for anything else. So your total cost in $ would be the cost of the servo or servos if you stuff up. Plus you need to live with the timing of the recoil and flash to be off.

Now I'd like to talk about the cost of the sivroe unit @ $17.90 AUD. I realise that everyone wants to get something for nothing. You might think $17.90 AUD is too much to pay whilst I think $17.90 is for too little. So let's break down the cost.

First up for $17.90 you get free international shipping in a padded envelope. Now nothing is ever for free and if anyone seriously thinks they actually EVER get free shipping I can't help you. It costs $3.20 for the actual postage and say 80 cents for the envelope. Factor that in and the cost of a sirvoe if you rocked up here would be only $14.90.

So what do you get for your $14.90???

Well first and foremost you get something that is designed to do the job you want it to do with minimal fuss and time on you part. Not only that with a little effort on the user end one can mod the parameters of the servo motion to make the servo operate left or right handed, adjust recoil times or even have a dual action for flak cannons. WITHOUT having to chop up a perfectly good servo.

Don't care about that .. it's still $14.90 . Well Ok I'll break that down. RCTA is NOT a hugh enterprise it is JUST me and although I'm always seeing posts on social media about supporting small businesses it's usually just bull... Actual product numbers are usually in the 10's so there is no great discounts I can get on PCB manufacture or parts supply. A sirvoe PCB probably costs me about $2 so the sirvoe is now down to $12.90

I'm a biologist not a computer programmer so I chose to use a microcontroller easy to program the downside of this decision is that they cost MORE and I can not get them either pre programmed NOR can i get them added to the PCB by machine so I have to both solder the microprocessor and program program EACH unit individually. The cost of a sirvoe micro is about $4 AUD and I get them shipped from the UK. If postage is factored in each micro costs at least $5 AUD bringing the sirvoe down to $7.90

With sirvoe you get a servo cable $0.20, 2 x tantalum caps $1.80 some resistors and headers which I'm going to price at about $0.50 to make it a round $2.50 in components ... sirvoe is now $5.40

Then let's not forget the good old PAYPAL fees @ $0.30 plus 2.9% cutting out a further $0.80 ...whittling my mega potential profit to $4.60

Now out of that $4.60 you are getting me to hand assemble, program and MOST IMPORTANTLY check the full functioning of the unit before travelling down to the post office and posting the item in a timely fashion along with a photo for proof of purchase. Realistically out of that $4.60 I barely have enough to get a small coffee from McDonalds and I'm not factoring in RCTA business cost like paying to maintain a web presence, etc..

So if I appear a little miffed when people want something for nothing .... well to me you actually ARE!!!!!

Cheers
Kevin G
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Jarlath
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Re: Basic HL/Taigen Recoil mod Query

Post by Jarlath » Thu Apr 23, 2020 5:48 pm

Hey Kevin,
Lost my computer HD in January and missed this response.

I'm not looking for a stupidly cheaper alternative. I mean features wise. So apologies if I offended. I am looking for a more specific design compared to the Servoe. Why? Because the servoe does not do what I want.

The Servoe, takes a 0-100 pulse signal input and creates a -100 to +100 continuously cyclic pulse signal output correct? (I'm a mechanical guy, not electrical, so my wording may be off).

What I am looking for is something similar, but the 0utput would be a single stroke. from -100 to +100 with -100 @ start and reversible (in case servo is wrong directional start.)
Fast in initial direction, slower in the return to start position. And thinking about it, it is likely more complicated because of my specific requests (LOL, took your response, and my reply to visualize that).

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phyrephish
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Re: Basic HL/Taigen Recoil mod Query

Post by phyrephish » Fri May 01, 2020 11:19 am

In reply
The Servoe, takes a 0-100 pulse signal input and creates a -100 to +100 continuously cyclic pulse signal output correct? (I'm a mechanical guy, not electrical, so my wording may be off).

No you are completely incorrect.
If set to recoil servo function if sirvoe detects a +100 it will start the recoil action in a clockwise manner.
If sirvoe detects a -100 it will start the recoil action in a anti-clockwise manner

I don't understand the next bit

However, the recoil action of all RCTA products sirvoe, MAKO, Asp, ... all employ a realistic action whereby the recoil back is as instant as the servo will allow followed by a slower return to fire position. That programming has been consistent from the very first implementation nearly a decade ago.

Here is sirvoe on a Tamiya MFU


Not only that - all the parameters of servo operation are user changeable. Source code is available you simple add in the values you want and re-program the board.

Code: Select all

;=======================================
;USER EDIT SECTION
;=======================================

SYMBOL USERCHOICE  =0  	;[0-3] Details below
				;0 Program determinant
				;1 Elevation servo with guns on same channel
				;2 Recoil servo
				;3 Elevation/turret servo with FULL range
				;4 Single FLAK recoil servo
				;5 Burn Effects smoke control
				;6 MAKO Trigger
				;7 Automatic machinegun servo

;UNIVERSAL PARAMATERS
SYMBOL CANONLIMIT =180 	;[170-190] Limit for activation of main cannon
SYMBOL MACGNLIMIT	=120 	;[110-130] Limit for activation of machine gun
SYMBOL MAXSERVO	=225 	;[170-225] Maximum pulse for servo
SYMBOL MINSERVO	=75	;[75-130]  Minimum pulse for servo

;---------------------------------------
;RECOIL SERVO PARAMATERS
;RELOAD TIME
SYMBOL RELOAD     =3	;[1-5] Number of seconds required for reload
;CLOCKWISE MOVEMENT
SYMBOL SERVO_RTF	=200	;[200-225] Postion of servo at maximal extent of barrel (Ready to fire RTF)
SYMBOL SERVO_REC	=124	;[ 75-199] Position of servo at full extent of recoil (Recoil position REC)
;ANTICLOCKWISE MOVEMENT
SYMBOL RSERVO_RTF	=100	;[ 75-100] Postion of servo at maximal extent of barrel (Ready to fire)
SYMBOL RSERVO_REC	=176	;[101-225] Position of servo at full extent of recoil (Recoil position)
;LED CANNON FALSH PERIOD
SYMBOL FLASHTIME	=180	;Time of LED cannon flash

;---------------------------------------
;FLAK RECOIL SERVO PARAMATERS
SYMBOL FLAKROUNDS =4	;MUST BE AN EVEN NUMBER
[/coce]

Cheers
KG
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